John 5:7-8 “For there are three that bear record in heaven, the father, the word and the holy ghost: and these three are one.”
I John 5:7-8 of the King james version cannot be validly used as a basis for the alleged Trinitarian doctrine. The authenticity of I john 5:7-8 of the king james version has long been in question. The statement in the said verses—“…in heaven: the father, the word and the holy ghost, and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth.”—is what scholars commonly call the “JOHANNINE COMMA”. Scholars seriously question the authenticity of the comma because it is absent in all the ancient greek manuscripts of the new testament:
“The comma is absent in all the ancient greek manuscripts of the NT with the exception of four rather recent manuscripts that date from the 13th to 16th centuries. The comma is lacking in such Ancient Oriental versions as the Peshitta, Philoxenian, Coptic, Ethiopic, and Armenian…”
“The fathers of the east do not quote or refer to the johannine comma in their Christological controversies. The omission indicates that the comma was not part of the biblical context of their time. For they surely would have used it had it been in the text.” New Catholic Encyclopedia
Moreover, The use of Johannine Comma was apparently influenced by a preconceived belief in the trinity. Starting as a gloss or a commentary, the Johannine Comma eventually found its way into the text itself: “The development of the Comma can be followed in the ecclesiastical writers of the late 4tha and 5th centuries, especially in Spain and Africa. Apparently, it developed as a result of Trinitarian interpretation of the triad: spirit-water-blood found in I john 5:8b.
By way of a gloss on the sacred text it eventually found its way into the text itself”. The rendition of I john 5:7 in the King james version is clearly erroneous. Even the catholic church, a major proponent of the doctrine trinity, denied the authenticity of the verse. The Vatican
“In recent times, the doubts concerning its authenticity have grown and the Holy office, in 1927, declared that, after careful examination of the whole circumstances, its genuineness could be denied” Fundamentals of catholic dogma
All of our bible translations today are but manuscript copies and it is not the original manuscript or "autogripa". Nobody can really say for sure 1oo% on which translation is exactly like the original. There are some texts that are in the King James Version and were not in other English Translations and there are some texts that are in other English Translations but were not in King James Version. In fact there are some Christian Denominations who only uses King James Version of the Bible. They believed that the King James Version Bible is the one that is closest to the original manuscript or autogripa and they have reasons to believed it. So, which translations is the closest to the original? The answer to that is, we don't know since we don't have the original to base it upon.
ReplyDeleteNow, is the “JOHANNINE COMMA”, “…in heaven: the father, the word and the holy ghost, and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth.” part of the original or only an insertion?
John 3:11
New King James Version (NKJV)
11 Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness.
This verse right here proves that the “JOHANNINE COMMA”, “…in heaven: the father, the word and the holy ghost, and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth.” is part of the original rather than insertion.
The text in St. John which in the Vulgate reads: "There are three witnesses in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Spirit, and these three are one; there are three witnesses on earth: the Spirit, the water, and the blood" (1 John 5:7-8). These words are not found in the early Greek manuscripts of the New Testament, nor in the best manuscripts of the Vulgate. They are probably a mystical interpretation that found its way as a gloss on the original text. Called the Johannine Comma, the text has more than once been the subject of the Church's interpretation. The Holy Office declared that scholars may further investigate the authenticity of the passage but accept the Church's judgment on their findings (June 2, 1927).
Deletesource: http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/dictionary/index.cfm?id=36857
John 3:11
ReplyDeleteNew King James Version (NKJV)
11 Most assuredly, I say to you, WE speak what WE know and TESTIFY what WE have seen, and you do not receive OUR WITNESS.
1 John 5:7
New King James Version (NKJV)
7 For there are three that BEAR WITNESS in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these THREE are ONE.
I PUT IT SIDE BY SIDE, FOR YOU TO SEE THE SIMILARITIES.
JOHN 3:11 IS A SOLID INTERNAL BIBLICAL EVIDENCE THAT THE "JOHANNINE COMMA" IN 1ST JOHN 5:7 IS PART OF THE ORIGINAL TEXT OR AUTOGRIPA.
This is funny. No serious bible scholar will say that the "WE" that Jesus referred to in John 3:11 were the other two Gods in the Trinity. You can believe whatever you want to believe though wrong. You need to study the bible again for your sake.
DeleteAnd if we are to accept Johannine Comma, we cant say the Jesus is a part of the trinity because what's with the Father and Holy Spirit is not Christ but THE WORD. And the "THREE ARE ONE" does not say these three are one GOD.